Episode 41: Why Civil Engineers Make Horrible Clients
Show Notes – Putting Your Business On The Map Podcast
Why You Need to Listen to This Episode
If you run a technical consulting business, this episode might save you from financial disaster. Landon Blake picks a necessary fight in this episode, calling out why civil engineers—despite being a “sibling profession” to land surveying—make some of the worst clients a surveying business can have.
This isn’t just inside baseball for surveyors. The lessons about client selection, contract negotiation, spotting red flags, and knowing your worth apply to ANY small business owner who works in professional services. Whether you’re a consultant, freelancer, or agency owner, you’ve probably dealt with clients who think they “almost understand” what you do—and that’s when the problems start.
Landon shares four specific reasons why civil engineers undervalue surveying work, real stories from the trenches (including a jaw-dropping tale about a $500,000 line of credit), and most importantly, what he did to protect his business. Spoiler: his company now works for completely different types of clients, and his business is healthier for it.
Key Takeaways for Small Business Owners
1. The “Sibling Profession” Problem Is Real
Your worst clients are often the ones who work adjacent to your expertise. They’re close enough to think they understand your work, but far enough away that they actually don’t. This creates a toxic dynamic where they undervalue your services and second-guess your methodology.
2. Beware Clients Who Want to “Formula-ize” Everything
Civil engineers (and similar professions) often want to reduce complex professional judgment to simple formulas. In surveying, boundary line determination isn’t just math—it involves legal interpretation, historical research, and expert judgment. If a client keeps asking “but can’t we just…” or “isn’t it basically just X + Y?”, that’s a red flag.
3. Price Pressure Creates Corner-Cutting Pressure
When clients are competing for work on price, they’ll pressure YOU to cut corners so they can win the bid. Landon shares a story about being asked to provide “staking” services that weren’t actually proper staking—just a way to check boxes on a proposal without doing the real work.
4. Read Your Payment Terms (Seriously)
Most small business owners focus on scope and fee, but payment terms buried in Section 8 of a contract can kill you. Landon was once asked to float $500,000 for a year to a client he wasn’t allowed to know. That’s 4 months of work + 3 months for billing + 6 months after payment to the prime contractor = 13 months of accounts receivable.
5. “Not All Business Is Good Business”
Taking a stand against bad clients means you’ll work with fewer clients—but they’ll be BETTER clients. After years of toxic contracts and corner-cutting pressure, Refined Horizons stopped working for most civil engineers. Today they serve utility companies, land attorneys, developers, and government agencies who value their expertise.
6. Surveyors (Not Engineers) Are Actually to Blame
Landon’s controversial take: civil engineers treat surveyors poorly because surveyors LET THEM. If more surveying businesses demanded dignity, reciprocity, and fair contract terms, the industry dynamic would shift. The problem persists because too many surveyors accept substandard treatment.
7. Client Selection Is a Superpower
Every “yes” to a bad client is a “no” to a good one. Every low-margin project with payment games ties up your team and prevents you from doing better work. Strategic client selection transforms your business from reactive to proactive.
8. Respect Yourself and Your Profession
As Landon puts it: “Don’t let clients treat you like a $2 prostitute.” Demand reasonable contract language, fair payment terms, and respect for your expertise. If that means walking away from work, walk away.
Episode Timestamps
- 00:00 – Introduction and apology for 6-month gap between episodes
- 02:35 – Episode overview: Why civil engineers make horrible clients
- 05:34 – The core problem: The sibling profession dynamic explained
- 08:46 – Reason #1: They think they know how to survey (it’s just math, right?)
- 15:22 – Real story: The formula-obsessed engineer
- 19:45 – Reason #2: They want to apply formulas to everything
- 24:33 – Reason #3: They’ll pressure you to cut corners for price
- 31:18 – Real story: The staking project that wasn’t really staking
- 37:42 – Reason #4: Toxic contract language and ridiculous payment terms
- 43:20 – Real story: The $500,000 line of credit to a mystery client
- 47:22 – Consequences: What happens when you take a stand
- 49:03 – Who’s really to blame? (Spoiler: It’s the surveyors)
- 50:45 – Where to find the podcast and how to support the show
Resources & Related Episodes
Related Episodes from Putting Your Business On The Map:
- Episode 2: The Worst Client of My First 5 Years Running a Land Surveying Business
- Episode 18: Finding Good Clients for Your Small Land Surveying Business
- Episode 23-24: Qualifying Leads and Controlling Proposal Costs (2-part series)
- Episode 34: 5 Questions You Can Use to Qualify Business Development Leads
- Episode 36-37: Understanding Contract Basics for Consultant Land Surveyors (2-part series)
- Episode 40: How to Crush Blood Sucking Parasites as Part of Your Business Development